Family Tree of the Adlers, Edwardses, Hogans, Lipscombes and Olivers
Born: 3 Nov 1771, Southwark, London, England
Christened: 1 Dec 1771, St George the Martyr, Southwark, London, England
Died: 1 Nov 1883, Parramatta, NSW, Australia
Buried: 2 Nov 1883, St John's Cemetery, Parramatta, NSW, Australia
Born: c.1777, Gloucs, England
Christened: 22 Mar 1778, Gloucester St Michael, Gloucester, England
Died: 13 Jul 1828, Parramatta, NSW, Australia
Buried: 14 Jul 1828, St John's Cemetery, Parramatta, NSW, Australia
Born: 9 Mar 1806, Parramatta, NSW, Australia
Christened: 23 Mar 1806, St John's Church, Parramatta, NSW, Australia
Died: 23 Apr 1855, Russell, Bay of Islands, New Zealand
Source: Birth - Cert. no. known but not obtained [VS]. Death - Death certificate [VS].
Andrew Snowden Jnr was the first child born to Andrew and Sarah Snowden (nee Darke) on 9 Mar 1806 at Parramatta.
On 23 Aug 1824 both Andrew Snr and Andrew Jnr petitioned His Excellency Sir Thomas Brisbane for a land grant. Andrew Jnr stated "being a Native of this Colony, nineteen years of age, who has never received any indulgence from Government, Your Memorialist therefore most humbly intreats that Your Excellency will be pleased to take his case into your kind consideration and give to him a proportionable grant of land for which your Excellencys humane kindness, Your Memorialist most humbly as in Duty bound will ever Pray". The Memorial also adds that "We hereby certify that Andrew Snowden Jnr is to our knowledge and belief a very Sober, and well instructed young man. We therefore in consideration of his good and steady conduct is by us recommended to Your Excellencys humane and kind Attention".
A postcript in different handwriting states "This petitioner is a native of Parramatta - his father can assist him should he obtain a grant of land." Both these Memorials were written in the same handwriting in a very ornate style. It appears that both Andrews were illiterate because the signatures are both the same, the style matching the handwriting of the Memorial. On 4 Mar 1830 Andrew Jnr was a signatory to an article in the Sydney Gazette - re the retirement of Police magistrate A.C. Innes Esq. J.P.
14 Nov 1831 - This is an extract from the Sydney Herald, Monday - "Supreme Court, Criminal Side. Monday, Nov 7 - Before Justice Dowling & the usual Commission. James Kelly was indicted for killing & slaying Cornelius Roach, alias "the Waste Butt"; & John Dean, Andrew Snowden (Jnr) & Samuel Sumers, as accessories, at Parramatta, on the 13th August. The prisoners were acquitted & discharged. The cause of the death of the deceased being left too uncertain." (Full transcription below)
It appears that Andrew was 'more likely involved in egging on a drunken fight and was often in trouble with the Police' - according to descendent Beryl Rooke. He and his brother Henry were acquitted of Pig/Cow stealing at Hartley, year not known, no conviction. They boasted they had been stitched up! Both Andrew Jnr and Henry are on a list of persons mentioned in the Sydney Herald for the year 1835 as Reward Offered For!
There is no record of Andrew Jnr ever having married. Little is known of his life in NZ - perhaps he helped his brother Henry in his business enterprises - no mention can be found in family records.
Andrew Jnr died 27 Apr 1855 at Russell, New Zealand of paralysis. He was aged only 44 years and a Stockholder. No other details reported on Death Certificate.
MANSLAUGHTER November 7th 1831
Pleas Not Guilty
Verdicts all Not Guilty
Signed J ...
The King v James Kelly, John Deane, Andw Snowden and Saml Summers
Mary Ann Snowden
In the Supreme Court of NSW
The King against James Kelly and others, Sydney 7th Day of Nov 1831, I certify, that the undermentioned Persons were subpoened to attend the Supreme Court, as Witnesses on the Part of the Crown, in the above-mentioned Case; and that they did attend the said Court for the Times, and from the Places mentioned against their respective Names; viz.-
Names of Witnesses Free or Bond From Whence Distance fm Subpoened Sydney Alexander Kennedy Free Parramatta 16 miles John Eggleton T of L Parramatta 16 miles Joseph Bennett T of L Parramatta 16 miles James Watsford Free Parramatta 16 miles John Gilbert Free Parramatta 16 miles Samuel Gilbert Free Parramatta 16 miles Nathanial Payton Free Parramatta 16 miles Mary Ann Snowden Free Parramatta 16 miles John Hartshorn T of L Parramatta 16 miles Bernard Crunny Constable Parramatta 16 miles William Haywood Free Parramatta 16 miles Joseph Barnes T of L Parramatta 16 miles Robert Harris T of L Parramatta 16 miles John Thorn Constable Parramatta 16 miles John Peisley Free Prospect 22 miles Matthew Anderson Free Parramatta 16 milesAll of the above spent 1 day in court. There are mathematical calculations in the Allowance column.
The name, William Monks (T of L, Parramatta, Bond), has a line drawn through it.
Signed by W. H Moore For His Majesty's Attorney General
New South Wales (To Wit.) - Be it Remembered, That John Kinchela, Esquire, Doctor of Laws, His Majesty's Attorney General for the Colony of New South Wales, who prosecutes for His Majesty in this Behalf, being present in the Supreme Court of New South Wales, now here, on the First Day of November in the Year of our Lord One Thousand Eight Hundred and thirty one at Sydney, in the Colony aforesaid, informs the said Court, that James Kelly late of Parramatta in the Colony aforesaid, Labourer not living the fear of God before his eyes but being moved and seduced by the instigation of the Devil, on the thirteenth Day of August in the Year of Our Lord One thousand Eight Hundred and thirty one with force and arms at Parramatta aforesaid in the Colony aforesaid, in and upon one Cornelius Rooke in the peace of God and our said Lord the King then and there being feloniously did make an assault and that the said James Kelly with both the hands and feet of him the said James Kelly the said Cornelius Rooke in and upon the head neck belly back and sides of him the said Cornelius Rooke then and there feloniously and violently did strike and beat and that the said James Kelly with both the hands and feet of him the said James Kelly the said Cornelius Rooke to and against the ground then and there feloniously and violently did cast and throw giving to the said Cornelius Rooke then and there as well by the said striking and beating of him the said Cornelius Rooke in and upon the head neck belly back and sides of him the said Cornelius Rooke as also by the casting and throwing of him the said Cornelius Rooke to and against the ground as aforesaid with both the hands and feet of him the said James Kelly as aforesaid ... mortal bruises in and upon the head neck belly back and sides of him the said Cornelius Rooke of which said mortal bruises the said Cornelius Rooke then and there did die. And the said Attorney General further informs the said court here that John Deane late of Parramatta aforesaid in the Colony aforesaid Labourer Andrew Snowden late of the same place Labourer and Samuel Summers late of the same place Labourer not having the fear of God before their eyes but being moved and seduced by the instigation of the devil on the same day and year last aforesaid with force and arms at Parramatta aforesaid in the Colony aforesaid feloniously .. prevent aiding abetting and assisting the said James Kelly the felony aforesaid in manner and ... aforesaid to do and commit and so the said Attorney General informs the said Court here that the said James Kelly, John Deane, Andrew Snowden and Samuel Summers him the said Cornelius Rooke in manner and form aforesaid feloniously did kill and slay against the form of the statute in such case made and provided and against the peace of our said Lord the King his Crown and Dignity.
Signed John Kinchela
According to the Sydney Herald - Monday, 14 Nov 1831
Supreme Court Criminal Side
Monday, Nov 7 - Before Justice Dowling & the usual Commission.
James Kelly was indicted for killing & Slaying Cornelius Roach, alias the Waste Butt, & John Dean, Andrew Snowden & Samuel Sumers, as accessories, at Parramatta, on the 13 Aug. The prisoners were acquitted & discharged. The cause of the death of the deceased being left too uncertain.
Depositions taken before me William Southwaite Esquire, Coroner, for the district of Parramatta this sixteenth day of August one thousand eight hundred and thirty one touching the death of Cornelius Rooke
Alexander Kennedy Superintendent to Barracks having been duly sworn states
that deceased was attached to Barracks on Saturday morning about sunrise I
mustered the men as usual deceased was present. He was then sober having slept
in Barracks all night. I did not see deceased after that until yesterday
morning when I saw him between seven and eight o'clock dead.
Signed by A. Kennedy
John Eggleton having been duly sworn states I am overseer to the Road gang
(twenty six) about seven o'clock in the morning of Saturday last I inspected
the men, deceased was present and in good health - I then gave over my charges
to Charles Blanch and another overseer and after that I did not see deceased
until seven on Saturday morning when he was dead. It was the duty of deceased
to work on the road until two o'clock that day. After I gave up the charge I
went to Sydney. I passed the place where I saw deceased lay about twelve
o'clock on Saturday night. I was perfectly sober. If deceased had been on the
spot when I passed I think I must have seen him. It was star light.
Signed by John Eggleton
Joseph Bennett having been duly sworn states that between twelve and one
o'clock of Saturday last in the day I saw deceased at John Dean's (licenced
publican) scouring the rooms. I staid in the room about an hour I gave him two
glasses of rum which he drank it might be three glasses. I and my mate
Hawthorn then went home and left deceased scouring the room. I have known him
long. I think he could stand a good deal of spirits - I never knew him
quarrelsome without provocation. An hour and a half after I left the Public
House I saw a crowd going towards the river - I didn't see deceased. I
followed the crowd immediately. When I arrived near the waterside. I saw Rooke
(the deceased) & one Kelly fighting - there might be about forty present - I
saw them fight four rounds - they appeared both to be drunk. They could both
stand up to square without being assisted. I saw both fall - I saw John Deane
pick up the deceased. I had not seen Kelly that day, until I saw him in the
fight. I heard nothing of any bets - I left before the fight was over. I heard
no one call out there was foul play - deceased was never quarrelsome even in
liquor to the best of my knowledge - I have known him long - I observed
deceased during the fight shiver very much - I returned home before the fight
was over and about two hours after my return my daughter about nine years of
age told me that she had seen Rooke on a man's back taken to Dean's house. I
observed the following persons looking on at the fight - namely Samuel
Gilbert, John Gilbert, William Monks, Samuel Summers, Robert Harris, William
Heywood, Andrew Snowden, Henry Burgin - Little Paddy and John Deane were the
seconds. I saw them picking the respective parties up - on further
recollection there was James Martin present at the fight - he was clearing the
ring - there was no cord round it - About nine or ten o'clock on Saturday
night I went into Dean's house I might stayed about half an hour - during the
time I was in the House or during the whole evening I did not hear Rooke's
name mentioned. I live next door - a person wishing to go from Dean's House by
the back Premises to my door could not go except by climbing over the rails -
the fence is good - I think deceased ... worth of the fight - they both seemed
to fall together - I made no enquiry about Rooke the deceased at Deane's
House, on the Saturday evening he had been my servant about thirteen or
fourteen months he left my Service last Thursday week. I returned home from
Deane's about half past ten on Saturday Evening.
Signed "X" (his mark) Joseph Bennett
James Watsford the younger having been duly sworn states that about three
o'clock on Saturday last I saw deceased (Rooke) and a person of the name of
Kelly fighting. I did not see the first strike - I saw them fighting for about
a quarter of an hour or twenty minutes - they were fighting behind Mr Gilberts
near the riverside - whenever deceased fell John Deane picked him up and held
him on his knee - I don't know whom picked up Kelly - Deane held his leg out
when deceased was falling - I saw it once - I heard Summers say it was one
pound a side - When I first went one of deceased's eyes was shut - he could
only see by one eye the whole time I was there. I know there were stakes laid
a I saw money paid between Summers and another - James Martin the Stakeholder
- Summers afterwards paid money at Dean's House to Kelly. I don't know how
much was paid to Kelly. I was standing at the outside of the door - I think
previous to the fight that Rooke must have had a few glasses. I think Kelly
was more sober than deceased. I saw present at the fight, Samuel Gilbert, John
Gilbert, William Monks, Samuel Sommers, Robert Harris, William Heywood,
Andrew Snowden, Henry Burgin and John Deane. I first saw on my arrival that
Snowden was a second. He picked deceased up who had fallen from a blow he
received from Kelly which I saw given - he was picked up the second time which
I saw by John Deane - on deceased's third fall which I saw he was picked up by
William Heywood - I saw Rooke carried from the ground on the back of a man to
Deane's House - ... him taken in when he was on the floor in the tap room. Deane
immediately came and told the man who carried deceased home to conduct him to
bed - he was then taken to bed in the room adjoining the tap and laid on his
back - Deane then turned deceased round on his side - during the time I was
there I did not hear deceased speak - I saw the last blow given at the battle,
deceased fell and did not speak - I was within a yard of deceased - Deane then
asked Harris if he had a pen knife or a lance - Harris replied he had one but
he would not venture to bleed him - Deane replied "lend it to me and I'll
chance it" - Harris said he would not lend it him but advised Deane to send
him to the Hospital - Deane then asked who would take him (deceased) up to his
(Deane's) house - a person offered to take him and he was conveyed on the back
of a man to Deane's House - I followed him all the way home about a yards
distance - after deceased was placed in bed Deane and another man came out of
the room and I heard the room door fastened - During the time deceased was
being carried Home, blood issued from his mouth - his face was much disfigured
- he did not appear to me to be holding on by the person who carried him - his
arms were quite loose.
I believe when the deceased was put to bed at Deane's he was dead.
Signed by James Watsford
James Martin having been duly sworn states that on Saturday last between two
and three o'clock I saw a crowd collected near the riverside at the back of Mr
Gilbert's house - I went and saw Rooke and Kelly fighting - I might be there
for about half an hour or something ... - I saw Kelly and Rooke fall more that
two or three times - I heard Summers say he would bet a sovereign with anyone
upon Kelly - I heard Monks say it was a shame to let them fight they ought to
be parted as Rooke was shivering. I then saw Rooke knocked down again by Kelly
and after that I did not hear deceased speak - Deane called out to deceased
when he had last fallen and said "Rooke" five or six times but I did not hear
Rooke speak - Deane said he (deceased) was only ... - I did not hear Deane ask
for any person to assist in carrying deceased home. I saw deceased placed on a
man's back by persons I don't know - the deceased was taken away but where I
don't know. During the fight I saw Robert Harris there. Deane asked Harris to
bleed him (deceased) - Harris replied what would he think if the deceased died
and advised Deane to let deceased lie still a little and hold his head up.
Deane then put on the deceased's shirt with the assistance of others
Signed by James Martin
James Martin having been further examined states - I heard John Deane say he
had seen Rooke fight for a fortnight - he was sure he could stand for a week.
Signed by James Martin
John Gilbert having been duly sworn states that between two and three o'clock
on Saturday last I saw two persons fighting near the river at the back of my
House - their names are Kelly and Rooke - Heywood and Andrew Snowden were
seconds for Rooke - I saw Rooke fall several times - I think Deane picked him
up occasionally - During all the time I was there I was not more than half a
dozen yards from the space of ground where they were fighting - I was on the
ground half an hour or thereabouts - I will not swear the deceased fell twenty
times - he might fall ten times - there was no Doctor present. Harris was
requested to bleed deceased. I will not swear positively whether Deane
requested him or not - two or three spoke at same time - Deane might request
him and to the best of my knowledge he did - Harris refused to bleed him -
Deceased was put on the back of some man by three persons - I know the greater
part of the persons there. I cannot say I can speak to the three identical
persons - I have seen the same three persons before. Deane might be one of the
three - to the best of my belief he was. I have no doubt the deceased's
seconds assisted in helping him on the man's back. I did not follow the man to
Deane's - my father said it was a great shame because he thought the deceased
was beaten - at the time he was put on the man's back, I observed scars on the
face his nose bled he shivered for several seconds before the battle was over
- during the time I was present I conceived the battle fair. I did not go to
Deane's that night. I have heard that a pound was staked between Snowden and
Summers. I believe deceased was insensible when he was taken off the ground -
his hands appeared quite helpless - when put on the man's back I should think
he was alive but insensible. I saw him take his breath about two minutes
before he was put on the man's back. I observed Deane put a shirt on the
deceased when down on the ground. His head was held up by Deane and Andrew
Snowden. I will not swear Heywood was not there - he might be ... - I cannot
Signed by John Gilbert
Samuel Gilbert having been sworn states that seeing a crowd assembled between
four and five o'clock on the Saturday last near the riverside I proceeded to
the spot and saw two persons of the names of Rooke and Kelly fighting. I might
be there a quarter of an hour - I frequently saw blows exchanged. I think they
had both been drinking - I saw five or six rounds - I considered nothing
unfair - I saw John Deane
lift Rooke up - it might be twice. Andrew Snowden and Heywood also lifted him
up. I said it was a shame for two such old men to fight. I was present when
fight was over and the man was sent away. I saw him put on the back of a man
whom I don't know - I heard someone ask harris for a knife to bleed deceased.
I cannot say that Deane asked for it. He might - deceased was bleeding at the
nose - the deceased appeared perfectly helpless - he could stand on his legs -
he shivered much during the fight. Seeing the deceased shiver I said it was a
pity they should let the old man fight - after the fight I went close up to
the deceased but did not hear him speak. He was then lying on the ground.
Signed by Samuel Gilbert
William Monks having been duly sworn states that about one o'clock on Saturday
last I was in John Deane's House. I heard a row between two persons in the
adjoining room to that I was in - I Summers came to me and asked me if I would
lend him a dollar. I asked him what for. Summers replied he wanted it. There
was going to be a fight. I asked him who with. He replied between a man named
Rooke and one Kelly. I said I would not lend it him. I was sure Rooke would
beat him (Kelly) and therefore I would not lend it him. Upon that Summers went
out of the room I was in. there were two or three other persons sitting in the
same room with me. About ten minutes after Summers left me Andrew Snowden came
in - he told me to have nothing to do with Kelly. Upon that he left the room.
No other conversation passed between him and me. About five minutes after I
went out to see if they (Rooke and Kelly) were gone out to fight. Finding they
were gone I followed them to the riverside near Mr Gilberts - they were
stripping - they immediately began to fight - I think deceased and Kelly had
both had a little to drink. I have known both a long time - Rooke threw Kelly
a great many times - I think Rooke fell the oftenest(!) - I was present during
the whole of the fight - I heard that two pounds were staked - a person of the
name of Joseph Barnes was second to Kelly and a person called Paddy - Deane
was second for Rooke and also young Snowden. There was also another person
named William Haywood - I saw each of the three pick up deceased as he fell -
I said to Mr Gilbert. It was a pity that Rooke should be allowed to fight
anymore - I saw some foul plays - I observed Deane and Snowden preventing
deceased's fall by standing behind him with their legs stretched out. Towards
the latter end of the fight I saw deceased shiver very much - which I conceive
was occasioned by fatigue in fighting - I think the fall which deceased got
last was occasioned by Kelly's blow - I then returned to Deane's and staid
about an hour and a half. About ten minutes after my arrival at Deanes I saw
deceased brought upon the back of a man whom I do not know - I never saw him
before. The man laid deceased on the floor in the tap room - I asked the man
who carried him if he had no other place but that to put him in upon which he
and another individual carried him into another room - adjoining the Tap Room
- the men laid him on a bed on his right side - I went in with him - Deane
arrived about five minutes afterwards and went into the room where deceased
lay - I went in with him - he rose deceased's head and then he and I came out
of the room. I positively swear deceased was alive at this time. I saw him
breath - I did not hear deceased speak or groan after he left the ground.
Deane was rather in Liquor - no conversation passed between Deane and me
during the Enquiry respective deceased. I was in the tap room the whole time I
was in the house. I positively swear no person entered the room where deceased
lay during the time I was in the House - no person came to Enquire after him
to my knowledge - I did not hear deceased's name mentioned by anyone after
Deane and I came out of this room. I heard deceased sigh after he was placed
in bed. He was lying on his right side and considered him in a dangerous state
- I left the house about half past six - when I left did not know whether
deceased was dead or alive - Kelly came into Deane's house whilst I was there
with some dollars in his hand which he said was part of the battle money. I
heard it said at the Ring before the battle was over that Deane had sent for a
Constable to make a babble of the fight and from this I judge Deane's man
(Rooke) was losing the fight and that he wanted to save his stake. On hearing
of deceased's death the following morning I said "I was surprised but I did
not think he would die so soon" - I certainly considered it absolutely
necessary that deceased should have had medical advice whether it would have
saved his life I cannot say - during the fight I saw a person hold a watch in
his hand which I also saw given to him by Deane previous to the fight. He told
me he held the watch for the purpose of keeping the time. I said he ought to
act fair to both parties - he replied he would.
I saw James Martin clearing the ring with a large pole in his hand. I heard during the fight Martin was the stakeholder. The reason why I know deceased was alive when in Deane's bed is owing to the blood which issued from his nostrils being blown to the wall - his mouth might be about three inches from the wall he breathed strong - nothing was given to him to drink or to clear his mouth out in my presence
Signed by William Monks
Nathanial Payton having been duly sworn states that about three o'clock on
Saturday last I was standing at my door and saw a lame man carrying a hat in
his hand which I know to be Rookes - the person carrying the hat I know by the
name of 'Archer Dick'.
Signed by Nathanial Payton
Mary Ann Snowden having been duly sworn states I have lived with my
brother-in-law John Deane ever since he was married. I heard in the afternoon
of a quarrel between Kelly and Rookes. They wanted to fight in Deane's yard -
this I heard from my sister Mrs Deane. They afterwards went to the Riverside
as I was told by my sister. I saw Rooke some time afterwards brought home on a
Signed "X" (her mark) Mary Ann Snowden
John Hartshorn having been duly sworn states I know Joseph Bennett. I was in
his company at John Deane's about twelve o'clock on Saturday last. I saw Rooke
there he was cleaning the floor - either once or twice Bennett gave him a
glass - I was in Deane's for about twenty minutes - I then left and was not in
the house again until tonight. I never heard a word of the Deceased afterwards
until Sunday Morning - deceased took a glass at the counter of something. I
don't know whether it was rum or wine.
Signed by John Hartshorn
*Note on the side of the below testimony reads - COMMITTED FOR PERJURY and is signed by the Coroner William Southswaite.
James Martin (free) having been duly sworn states I live in the house of John
Deane. I have lived with him about six weeks. On Saturday last the thirteenth
I saw Rooke and Kelly in Deane's House about three o'clock drinking a pot of
beer and smoking a pipe. Others were with them. Rooke asked Kelly for a pipe -
Kelly replied he would not give him a pipe unless he was a better man than
him. Rooke then said "Come into the back yard and I'll fight you for it". "No"
I said "you shall not without the Master's permission". I called for John
Deane and he came and said there should be no fighting in the yard at all.
Kelly and Rooke then shook hands and Rooke said they would go down to the
waterside and fight. Kelly said animosity - "I'll fight you for friendships
sake" - upon which Rooke said he could beat him in two minutes. This
conversation took place in the Tap Room. The room was full. They then went to
the riverside. I followed and arrived just when they had begun to fight. I
don't think I was there more than two minutes. I saw the stakes laid down at
the place where they fought - a pound a piece was laid down - Kelly asked
Summers for ten shillings - he wanted to fight for it. Summers lent him the
ten shillings and the pound was made up. I don't know how the other stakes
were made up. I heard Snowden say he laid down the other pound. I saw him lay
it down. It was first laid on the ground. Snowden then asked who would hold
it. It was then given to me. I was the Stakeholder - they might be a little
more than a quarter of an hour making up the stakes. I was standing looking at
them. They began to strip immediately they got down. They began to fight
directly. I might be there for about half an hour altogether - I was there for
about half an hour after the battle began. I don't know how many times Kelly
or Rooke fell down - they fought for about half an hour - after the battle was
over they shook hands and walked up together to John Deanes. I saw them within
five minutes after I saw them in the ring at Deane's house drinking a glass of
brandy together. I asked Deane for a pint of Brandy at Kelly's request. Kelly
saw he was the winner and should treat all. Kelly paid the price - four
shillings - I gave the money to the Landlord - Deane - the house was full. I
did not know any of them - after I had given the money to my Master I went
into the back kitchen. About an hour afterwards I returned into the Tap Room
and saw Rooke standing at the Bar asking Mrs Deane for a glass of rum and an
ounce of tobacco. Mrs Deane at first refused him but afterwards gave it him.
He then wished her good night and went out of the house. This was half past
seven in the evening. He walked out of the house alone and said he was going
to Barracks - which was he turned when he got out I don't know Mr Thorn the
Wardsman searched the tap room and the bar. He was in the house for about five
minutes. The fight lasted half an hour. Kelly took the first slap of the pint
of brandy and filled another for Rooke which I saw him drink. Mr Horne went
into the house about nine o'clock. I made the ring myself. I paid two pounds -
the amount of stakes - to Kelly in the Tap Room. Summers was present at the
time. Rooke was then washing himself. I know Kelly and Rooke well. I had
nothing allowed to me for holding the stakes
Signed "X" (his mark) James Martin
Barnard Crunny having been duly sworn states - I am a Constable, about two
o'clock on Saturday Constable Haywood came to me and said there was a pitched
Battle down by the river and that they wanted to do away with the fight - by
this I understood they wanted to make a babble of it - Heywood told me we were
to have a caser or two - the meaning of the word caser is a dollar - I then
went to Mr Thorn the Chief Constable and reported to him what I heard - he
immediately directed me and Heywood to go and disperse the mob. Just as we
reached Mr Gilbert's corner we saw a crowd coming from towards the river.
William Monks said to me "you are too late" I replied "we are the less
trouble". I saw no fight - I saw Kelly walking up in the direction of Deane's
House with many others. He had marks of blood upon his face. I did not see
Rooke after the battle. I met Andrew Snowden the younger soon afterwards who
told me that John Deane had laid thirty shillings and he (Snowden) fifteen and
that if we (the constables) had been a few minutes sooner they (Snowden and
Deane) would not have lost the money but for what we did do he would treat us.
Signed B Crunny
Barnard Crunny recalled - states I went to Deane's House in Company with
Constable Howe to see that all was right. We saw nothing wrong. Deane gave us
each a glass of spirits and said it was the first time he had seen me. There
was no noise.
Signed B Crunny
William Haywood - having been duly sworn states that on Saturday last about
two o'clock I saw a lot of people going down towards Gilbert's - in about half
an hour afterwards I went down myself and saw two men fighting named Kelly and
Rooke. There was a great crowd. I was there only two or three rounds I saw
deceased knock Kelly down. Summers assisted Kelly - Summers was within the
ring. He often said Kelly would beat Rooke. I saw John Deane, J Monks, Samuel
Gilbert, John Gilbert, Howlett, Harris, Snowden, Joseph Barnes and many others
whom I did not know. Snowden lifted up Rooke as also did Deane. The fight was
not over when I left. I picked Rooke up twice not more. I saw deceased shiver
very much. It was quite as likely it might be occasioned by fatigue as cold. I
heard Deane's wife say that the deceased was at the House about seven o'clock
on Saturday Evening. I was not in Deane's House during Saturday night. I did
not hear anyone say it was a shame. I did not consider that deceased had
received any injury. He appeared much fatigued. He had a cut on the side of
the right ear. Also on the bone cheek. I perhaps might wipe his face. I wiped
it with a handkerchief. I wiped it twice. I lifted him up two or three times.
Deane lifted him up three or four times. I swear that Snowden also lifted him
up twice. I don't know how many rounds were fought whilst I was there. I don't
know how many I saw.
Signed Wm Haywood.
Patrick Mortimer having been duly sworn states that after coming out of my Overseer's gate on Saturday last about twelve o'clock I saw a crowd about a dozen yards from the Gate. I joined the crowd and saw two persons of the names of Kelly and Rooke fighting. I saw blows exchanged. I assisted in raising Kelly when he fell. John Deane never assisted either party. I staid until the battle was over when the Constables came. I know Deane, Snowden, Monks and Heywood. Snowden did not take an active part. I cannot say how many I knew. I saw two Gilberts, young Watson, Sam the baker, Deane. I think Snowden was there. I cannot say how long exactly I was there. It was a quarter past twelve when I went to the waterside and I think it was finished by one. I did not see Rooke shiver much. I did not see Heywood lift either of the men off the ground. I swear I did not see Snowden lift either of the men. I have lived in Parramatta between five and six years. I daresay there were a hundred persons. I saw Samuel Summers. I did not see him assist. He might without my seeing.
Joseph Barnes having been duly sworn states that about two or three on
Saturday afternoon I went to a fight below Mr Gilbert's house. I saw two
persons of the names of Rooke and Kelly fighting. I saw them fight for about
ten minutes. It was not quite over when I left. I saw John Deane there. He was
acting as second to Rooke. He raised him up as he fell ... Haywood acted as
another second. I washed Kelly's face. Snowden did not take any active part
whilst I was there. I went to Deane's house that afternoon. I did not see
deceased. I saw a person lying in a small bed but cannot say who it was. I saw
Deane on Sunday morning after the death of deceased. He told me the man was
Signed Joseph Barnes
James Smith (a prisoner attached to Barracks) having been duly sworn states
that on Saturday last about two o'clock I was proceeding to the Barracks from
the Overseer's Garden I saw a crowd and I went to it. I saw two men fighting -
Kelly and Rooke - I know them both. I was at the fight for about ten minutes.
It was nearly over when I went. I saw Deane. He was backing Rooke. He helped
him up when he fell. I stayed at the fight until it was over. Kelly gave the
last blow. I was three or four yards from deceased when he fell. I heard Deane
say he would give in. Rooke was then held up in a sitting position. He looked
very weak. He could hold his head up a little. I saw him shivering very much
during the fight. I helped to put deceased's shirt on. A tall man had the
shirt. He still continued with same sitting position. Some person wanted to
bleed deceased. Harris said he would do no such thing. He knew the
consequence. Most of the people at the fight then went away. Deane said he
would not leave the man there. He would get him home. No one seemed inclined
to pick him up. I did pick him up. I volunteered to carry him home. He was a
dead weight. His arms being quite loose and his head inclined on my shoulder.
Just before the fight was over I heard deceased say he was cold. It was three
rounds before they finished. About two o'clock I arrived with the man on my
shoulder at Deane's House. Martin was in the Tap Room when I arrived - a
stranger was in the room and assisted in taking deceased off my shoulders. We
took him in to a bedroom after having laid him for a short time on the floor
of the taproom and laid him on a bed on his back. From the time I saw him
receive the last blow I did not heard him speak. I raised his head and have no
doubt he was alive at the time. I put him in the bed. I was in Dean's House
about ten minutes from the time I put the man in bed until I left the house.
Deane entered the House almost immediately after me. I had then laid the man
in bed. Deane asked where the man was and some person replied he was in the
little room. Deane did not go into the room to see him during the time I was
in the House. I have not seen deceased since I left the House on Saturday
afternoon. I heard many say at the fight that both Kelly and Rooke were very
fresh. I swear the deceased did not speak after I took him from the battle. I
also swear he did not take anything to drink. He appeared to be in a dangerous
state when I left him. He was not bleeding when I left him.
Signed by James Smith
Robert Harris being duly sworn states I was walking in the street on Saturday
last about two o'clock when I observed people running towards the waterside at
the back of young Gilbert's house. I went to the spot and saw Kelly and Rooke
fighting. At that time I did not know Rooke. They fought seven or eight
rounds. Young Heywood acted as second by picking deceased up. I did not know
anyone else. Deane was there washing his face. To the best of my knowledge
Deane did not ask us for a knife. Some persons asked me to bleed him. I said
No. It was "not my profession". There were no stakes deposited to my
knowledge. There was a person who kept the ring clear. I kept the outside the
ring all the time. Near a hundred people present. I was not more than ten
yards off the ring when deceased fell. I don't recollect who picked him up.
Time was called. I cannot say whether Snowden was or was not on the ground. I
saw Summers. He was offering to bet money with any one. He offered to lay
twenty shillings to fifteen shillings upon the battle. I did not see Summers
assist either of the seconds. The last time deceased fell was not by a blow
but by closing. I was at Dean's in about twenty minutes after the fight. I
don't know whether I saw Monks in the House. I did not stay in the House more
than five minutes. I saw Summers and Kelly. I swear it might be Deane who
asked me to bleed deceased.
Signed Robt Harris
Mr John Thorn Chief Constable having been duly sworn states that about seven
o'clock on Sunday morning Sullivan a constable informed me there was a man
between Patons's house and mine lying dead on the footpath. I immediately
proceeded to the spot and found the body to be that of Cornelius Rooke.
Knowing that he was a drunken character and frequented Deane's house I went to
Deane's house and was informed by Deane himself that deceased had left the
previous evening about seven o'clock. I told Deane I was sure deceased had
been murdered. My belief was then and still is that the body was carried to
the place where I saw him dead. Between nine and ten the evening proceeding I
swear he was not there as I walked over the ground myself.
Signed John Thorn
Joseph Barnes being recalled states I do not think Heywood ... as second merely
as a spectator
Signed Joseph Barnes
William Heywood being recalled states I did not see Barnes take an active
part. I only saw him wipe the face of one of them once. I cannot positively
Signed William Haywood
Deposition taken on the part of John Deane
John Peisley states that on Saturday last about six o'clock I called at
Deanes. I saw a room full of people. Deane told me there had been a fight and
showed me one of the men in bed. It was Rooke. Rooke looked up and asked Deane
for spirits. Deane said he thought he had got too much already and desired him
to go to sleep. I then left the room. I was in the House half an hour after
that but did not see deceased again.
Signed John Peisley
Robert Long a dragoon of the Sixteenth Lancers states that on Saturday night
about seven o'clock I was in Deane's House. About half past seven I saw a
person whom I have known to be Rooke come to the bar for tobacco which Mrs
Deane gave him. After this Rooke asked for a slap of rum which was refused.
She said "Rooke you had better go home to barracks" Rooke replied "I'll take
your advice and go home" He went out of the house immediately but where he
went I don't know. I observed him turn towards the barracks. He did not return
that night to my knowledge. I was in the bar the rest of the Evening. I was
afterwards at Mr Magouran's I left Mr Deanes about ten o'clock. The deceased
did not appear to be very tipsy. I went to Mr Magouran's about eleven o'clock
and staid 'til twelve.
Signed R Long
Signature of Wm Southwaite
I have examined the body of the deceased Cornelius Rooke. There are bruises on
different parts of the body. The face and ... The upper part of the heart, left
shoulder and scrotum and scratches on different parts of the body. The blood ...
surface of the brain ... with blood. With a considerable extra ... on the surface
of the brain. There is no fracture of the skull. The extra ... might be caused by
blows, by falls or by a fit of apoplexy. My opinion is that death was caused
by the extra ... of blood on the surface of the brain
Signed ... ... Surgeon.
Parramatta 4th Nov 1831
Re ... ...
I have only this day heard that a person of the name of Howlett is likely to be a witness for the ... and I immediately sent for him and took down his evidence - should you deem it necessary to subpoena Mrs Howlett and the servant to contradict him I will direct subpoene to be sent ... I will take care they are served.
Howlett first admitted to me that he had drank nothing before the evening of that day. Afterwards he admitted he might have had two or three glasses which he said could not affect him.
I have the ... ...
Your ... obedient Servant
Rex v Kelly and others - Manslaughter.
Matthew Howlett - ... residing in Parramatta it is understood will be subpoened by the Prisoners - He has been examined by the Coroner and states about eight o'clock on the Evening of the fight I called at Deane's and remained in the Bar only during the time I took a glass of rum. It might be three minutes. I saw the deceased standing against the Counter who appeared to me not very tipsey. Deceased asked either for a Glass of Rum or some tobacco. I do not recollect which. Deceased was talking to Mrs Deane - there were none others in the Bar except myself. Deceased, Mr Deane and a Solider, the last has since left the Country. I did not speak to Deceased. I have known him many years. Deceased appeared to have a scar on his forehead. I saw Deceased pass my house after the fight on a man's back.
Howlett's wife has since been examined by the Coroner. She will swear positively that her husband was not out of his own house after five o'clock that Evening. An Assigned Servant of his of the name of Goff will also swear to the same fact.
It is currently reported in Parramatta that Deane has been tampering with Howlett (who is an ignorant Man ) endeavouring by treating him with spirits to induce him to Corroborate the statement made by Martin who stands committed for Perjury. Indeed Howletts wife has confessed to the Coroner that it was Deane who persuaded her Husband to say what he has above stated.
And the said Jurors further say upon their Oath aforesaid that John Deane, Andrew Snowden and Samuel Summers were present at the time of the killing and slaying aforesaid in manner aforesaid committed. That is to say on the thirteenth day of August in the Year aforesaid at Parramatta aforesaid in the country aforesaid, then and there comforting abetting and aiding the said James Kelly to kill and slay aforesaid in manner aforesaid against the peace of Our Lord the King his Crown and Dignity.
And Moreover the Jurors aforesaid upon their oath aforesaid do say, that the said James Kelly, Samuel Summers and Andrew Snowden had not nor any of them had, nor as yet have, or hath any Goods or Chattels Lands or in Tenements, within the County aforesaid, or elsewhere to the Knowledge of the said Jurors, and the Jurors aforesaid upon their Oath aforesaid do say that the said John Deane at the time of the said killing and slaying aforesaid had goods and chattels contained in the Inventory to this Inquisition annexed which remain the Custory of
In witness whereof as well the aforesaid Coroner as the Jurors aforesaid have to this Inquisition put their Hands and Seals this seventeenth day of August One thousand Eight hundred and Thirty one.
Signed Wm Southwaite Coroner
"X" William Parker - his mark
"X" John Trelagar - his mark